The fandom reacton is really baffling to me.

[yvannairie]

So! I saw TROS.

I liked it!

Thoughts to follow once I familiarise myself with reasons why people hated it that don't sound like shipwar bullshit, but I feel validated that my favourite ship got its moment in the sun in a big way.

Comments

[autobotscoutriella]

I'll be very interested on your overall thoughts on it! I haven't seen it yet (familiar with all the spoilers, though, I usually look those up ahead of time for Reasons), but I did see an overwhelming amount of dislike that seemed to be "shipwar bullshit" and "projected a storyline on the movie and was upset when it didn't diverge from Typical Star Wars Tropes the way I personally wanted" before I blacklisted all the tags and resigned myself to getting no content from Tumblr.

...And then I switched tabs to Dreamwidth, and three separate people on my reading page had all made posts that were basically "yep, I loved it, it's got the same issues as Average Star Wars but it's fun as hell", and decided I'm going to camp on this site for the foreseeable future :D

[yvannairie]

Honestly like the one set of criticisms I feel hold water are the ones pointing out that the script is very poor and the pacing his super duper fast and jumps around too much, and the one where people who criticise TROS being yet another movie where a victim of abuse dies in a heroic sacrifice, finding it a gauche ending to their arc of personal growth and redemption.

But that's it, all the rest of it is like. Yeah, no, that doesn't sound like you went into this expecting a Star Wars movie. It's not as good as The Last Jedi... but what fucking is, that movie was bonkers good.

I have issues with the film, a fuckton of them, but I also had a ton of fun, and I'm always someone who enjoys a film for what I think it could be rather than the nuts and bolts exact execution anyway x'D I hope you have fun with it, too, once you get around to seeing it.

[autobotscoutriella]

Yeah, I could see that--I don't have super high expectations for a Star Wars script anyway, but I'm not surprised to hear that this criticisms are legit. It's too bad (but also I sat through Transformers: The Last Knight, which was basically three bad movies put in a blender to create one incoherent terrible movie, and liked it, so I'll probably be fine with this one). And the heroic sacrifice bit is...unfortunate, though again, it doesn't surprise me. (I adore the old Expanded Universe possibly more than the actual films, as much as I love those, and I recognized the storyline they were pretty clearly adapting--it ended pretty much the same way, and I had resigned myself to that ending before the spoilers. I really wish they'd avoided that trope, but...it's Star Wars. Problematic redemption tropes are par for the course.)

The Last Jedi was entirely too good to be a Star Wars movie, and it's possibly my favorite out of the entire series. They set the bar AWFULLY HIGH with that one.

Sounds like I'll love it, all things considered! I'll forgive a movie a lot if I had fun watching it, and when the execution isn't great but the premise is, I usually get excellent fanfic ideas. :D

[yvannairie]

> also I sat through Transformers: The Last Knight, which was basically three bad movies put in a blender to create one incoherent terrible movie, and liked it, so I'll probably be fine with this one

You're a stronger person than I am :'D but, yeah, TROS also has a feeling like they had two entirely different scripts at hand, one of them significantly worse than the other, and then they just mashed them together to get on with it. If you're into fanfic fodder-y conclusions to stories, then you'll be right at home.

(Also yeah, damn, Star Wars does not like characters who decide to be Less Bad living, huh? :/)

[autobotscoutriella]

Even better/worse: I sat through it twice. Because the first time I saw it, I had to go to the emergency room immediately after, so once I'd gotten all that sorted out, I thought "well, maybe it wasn't THAT incoherent, maybe I was just really out of it what with being in pain". So I went to see it again. Turns out it really is that bad. :'D

Sounds like it'll be right up my alley. I love movies that give me tons of reasons to sit down and work up extra scenes to fix plot holes, or straight-up rewrite things to make them make more sense--it's so much more fun afterward than "well, that was a great movie, but I can't add anything" XD

(I love that it's the sort of franchise where the redemption arc was guaranteed right from the start. I hate that it's the sort of franchise that was always going to end it with Redemption Equals Death. Ah, Star Wars...)

[yvannairie]

*NOISES OF SYMPATHETIC SUFFERING* I feel bad for intending to never watch the movies and using you as a filter for the good ideas. Sacrifices like yours are what keeps the fandom going :')

Yeah -- one of my friends got weirdly on my case about being like "I don't super care for things that are very good" b/c. I will just forget about them once I' m done. Same with shows that aren't complete, I don't particularly enjoy competing with the creators over who can make the better thing. And a *lot* of fans takes that as some kind of a backhanded way to call the thing bad??? Nah, man, imperfection is just a lot more engaging x'D

[autobotscoutriella]

It does make for an excellent baseline for what makes an Impossibly Bad Movie. "Well, I saw Transformers 5 IN THEATERS, so if *I* can't sit through this movie..." But really, the movies are best experienced as filtered through other people, I think :D Even I usually watch them by fastforwarding through large segments.

That's the whole reason I've never written fanfic for, say, anything by Tolkien, even though I love LOTR and the Hobbit--there's just nothing to fill in! I actively want to spend hours sorting out plot holes and figuring out what would have made the thing better. "Competing with the creators" is exactly how it feels with stuff that's super good--not that my writing's bad, but it doesn't mesh well at all with things like Tolkien. Things that are GOOD are hard to add to. Things with plot holes and problems are an invitation.

[shadaras]

It was a ton of fun! I'm looking forward to more of your thoughts. :)

Which ship is your favorite?

[yvannairie]

FinnRey! Although I ate up the FinnPoeRey content quite happily, I really enjoyed Poe and Rey having a very belligerent energy with each other with Finn being Anxious(tm) about them fighting in the background.

Finn being Force-sensitive and having a similar bond with Rey as he had with Leia and being able to sense her was such a good addition, and I enjoyed how much that builds further common ground for them. They were some of the first people either of them showed care towards, and I love how that bond becomes more significant as both of them come onto their power.

[shadaras]

The way Rey and Poe interacted in this movie sold me on Rey/Poe more than any fanfic has previously been able to, tbh, just because that particular kind of harried sniping just feels like fertile ground for potential shipping once the stressful crisis passes.

All of the trio got great interactions! And, yes, Force sensitive Finn was fantastic! I love everything about his growth. <3

[yvannairie]

Both Rey and Poe yell at other people when they're stressed, externalising that need for order and control really bad (which is why ultimately Rey was most afraid of herself, because that's the one thing she could always control, and why Poe's growing doubts of the rightness of his methods and judgement play such a big part in his arc over the movies) and I feel like they might be a little exhausting for each other on a day-to-day basis, but gosh. Gosh. They have such good chemistry and the snark is so benevolent and aaaaaaaa I loved it.

[shadaras]

Which is why they might not work as each other's only partner, but in a polyamorous relationship? I could see it being an important thread in the whole. :)

[yvannairie]

Yes yes yeeeesssssss you get me, you get me. And they definitely get enough moments of tenderness (even if they shout it at each other lol) that there's real affection there)

I can't wait. I wasn't into any of this after the first few movies but now I'm def gonna start reading fic and maybe even writing it